The Sins of the ancestors Vs The role of the descendants - Part III

(Friends, the following is the Rejoinder to the counter-arguments of Mr. Manivannan which is available in Part II of this Serial. The link is given here to facilitate reading and referencing.  http://vaeyurutholibangan.blogspot.in/2014/10/the-sins-of-ancestors-vs-role-of_24.html )

British : Indians : : Brahmins : Non-Brahmins

When the conflicts between the Hindus and Muslims, during the period of independence struggle,  were referred to in a querry, Mahatma Gandhi replied that there was, in fact, no problem between the  Hindus and Muslims except those created by the British. As long as the British remain here, they would create problems between the two and would not allow them to settle, said Gandhi.  Edward H Said refers to this episode in his book ‘Culture and Imperialism’. In all probability, the British must have been surprised that the technique of Divide and Rule followed by the Brahmins of India for about 3000 years by then had been working so successfully for the oppressors, who createdVarna and, then, caste system in the sub-continent and then perpetuated by creating dissension between one another and making it essential for rulers to ‘Protect’ it. 

Rulers, coerced to protect Varna System

Hindu - Muslim divide, which was a bogey created by the Hindu press then,  is only horizontal while the Varna and Caste divide is vertical. The Brahmins believe that they could incite one group against the other periodically without any rapproachment, so that they remain at the top. They enjoyed the sadistic pleasure when the infighting among the slaves continue without anyone taking notice of the role played by the originators of the conflict. They have, formally and methodically, been trained in this art of subjugation, by Chanakya, the First Political Terrorist of the World. In Chapter I titled “Means to injure an enemy”, in Book XIV, of Arthasastra, Chanakya makes it the duty of the king to protect the caste system. He refers to those who oppose the system as ‘wicked’ people. He narrates numerous conspiratorial methods that must be used for finishing off those ‘wicked’ people. Poisoning those ‘wicked people, setting fire to their houses, spreading poison through smoke in the wind, blinding the animals, methods of killing persons within a fortnight and within a month, etc., have been elaborated and enumerated by Chanakya for the education and guidance of his descendants. Dhana Nanda who brought in an egalitarian society was annihilated. King Vena who refused to follow the discriminatory penal code invented by the Brahmins was murdered cold-bloodedly by the priests. Temple premises were used to assassinate such kings, as narrated in Arthasastra. The past habit continues till date in different forms. It is now left to the ordinary people to fight for the casteless society in India. 

Chanakya’s era to British era

Numerous methods of creating dissensions between different groups have also been given by Chanakya. He did not, in essence, distinguish between the enemies during the period of war and the people who opposed the social-divide perpetuated through the Varna and Caste system. And that was followed by his descendants all through the history until the advent of the British era, during which period only the the millennia-old mischief played by the Brahmins got exposed to a great extent with evidence. 

Creating animosity against X by sympathising with Y

Creating animosity against Y by sympathising with X

Extol the Nizam and enslave the non-Brahmins

One such descendant of Chankya was Dalapati, the notorious jurist in the medieval era who codified a law to enslve the Sudras (which term includes all non-brahmins in the Hindu fold). Dalapati was the minister under the Muslim ruler of the Nizamshah dynasty of Ahmednagar which ruled Daulatabad. “Dalapati was an effective politician who had infiltrated the court of the Nizam Shah and managed to induce the Sultan to allow Hindus to be ruled independent of the Shariat under their own legal code”. He had written a Hindu civil, penal and ritual law called Nrisimha prasada. Composed during the period between 1490 and 1520, that book, like all other Dharmasastras, was meant to tighten the strangle-hold on the BCs and the SCs. His work would show that the intention of the Brahmins had been to retain their strangle-hold over the non-Brahmins, by praising the rulers, whoever it might be. While writing it, Dalapati had "extolled in several stanzans" the Muslim ruler. His Hindu law was enforced in that kingdom with such vigour that it has become part of the history of Hindu law. It also gets mentioned in Mayne's Hindu Law and Usage. 14th edition. 

Remove the top-most slab first

(The top-most slab says, 

"Hey, No. 4! It is No. 3 which is crushing you and not me")

When a man is crushed by the weight of the slabs that had fallen over him, one must remove the slab on the top first and then the next. Nobody can say that that victim was being crushed only by the lowest slab which was crushing his body and not the topmost slab. But, in India, the top slab is in the habit of diverting the attention of the lowest slab to focus on its immediate higher slab. As long as people believe in the propaganda of the top-most slab all other slabs, except the top-most one, will continue to suffer under the oppression of other slabs. 

The top-most oppressor. Enjoying the world by keeping all the people below them and crushing them all.	Slab 1:  Brahmins	Classified as Brahmins in Varna order
Oppressed as well as oppressor.  Persons suffering under the weight of one slabs above them and are crushing the third and fourth slab below them.	Slab 2: Non-Brahmin  Forward Castes	All the three categories are classified together as Sudras in the Varna hierarchy in the South
Oppressed as well as oppressor.  Persons suffering under the weight of two slabs above them and are crushing the fourth slab below them.	Slab 3: Backward Classes
The Oppressed.  Persons suffering under the weight of three slabs above them.	Slab 4:  Scheduled Castes

So, unless the top-most slab is removed first, the other slabs below that cannot be removed, easily and it is also not necessary to keep the top-most slab as it is. When there was temple entry in Madurai, the Brahmins who opposed it had locked the temple and propagated that the Goddess Meenakshi had run away. Periar cited this incident and said that when the Brahmins lose their varna-based privileges, they would carry on the movement against the varna system with more vigour. 

The arguments of Mr. Manivannan prove very clearly 1. that the Brahmins are not going to forego their ill-gotten privileges, on their own and 2. that they would always instigate the subjugated classes to act against one another. 

World history testifies to the fact that, very rarely, oppressors saw reason in the struggle of the oppressed and acceded to their right. 

With apologists like Mr. Manivannan, we know that our struggle for an egalitarian society will be only by educating the masses and helping them to extricate themselves from the cruel propagandists who, with mala fide intention, divert the focus of the suppressed. 

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That said, I would like to give para-wise reply as under: 

Para 1: I do not disown responsibility of intermediate castes in joining hands with the Brahmins to suppress those who are below them. But, it is always simpler to remove the burden from the top. Mr. Manivannan has not explained anywhere in his posts why the Brahmins should continue to retain the privileges like hereditary priesthood in money-spinning temples, etc., It is not the intermediate castes which deny the right to any caste ‘lower’ in the Brahminical Social Order. It is only the Brahmins who oppose all the non-Brahmins officiating as priests, in spite of the fact that they passed the examination and became qualifed to officiate as posts. Mr. Manivannan would do well to answer this question, without being wishy-washy once again. 

 Besides, Buddha and Mahavira and Asoka were not Aryans. All the non-Brahmins in India in the Hindu fold were and are Dravidians only. They were, later, classified by the Brahmins (Aryans) to be Kshatriyas (because the Brahmins were afraid of their muscle power), Vaisyas (because the Brahmins were willing to yield to money power) and Sudras. That they permitted cross-thread to be worn by the Kshatriyas and Vaishyas and, thereby, called them too as Dwijas does not make them Aryans. 

Para 2: I am not required to justify the commissions and omissions of the Dravidian parties. The fact is that the goal of the casteless society is yet to be attained. As long as the Brahmins oppose mainly the priesthood to non-Brahmins, they will subotage the efforts taken by others. They will always find some Pon.Radhakrishnan who is prepared to sit on the floor in front of Mr.Jayendran of Kanchi without any sense of shame. We will have to fight against the attitude of those people too. 

Para 3: Inter-caste marriages happen, in spite of the crooked casteists led by the Brahmins. It was the Brahmins who first started their campaign against inter-caste marriage both in ancient history and in the contemporary history. They compel all the brahmin boys of 15 years of age to promise that they would not marry outside their Varna, in spite of their being minors. Is it not a crime? People like Mr. Ramadas and others follow suit to achieve their myopic and astigmatic selfish ends.

Para 4: There had been many non-Brahmin leaders who came around like colossus to eradicate the caste system. Mahavir, Buddha, Narayana Guru, Mahatma Phule, Savitribai Phule, Periyar, Ambekdar were some of them. Individual contributions by learned scholars are many many. But, among the Brahmins, we could see only one person who was an activist against casteism during the last 3500 years and he was Bharatiyar, who was ostracised for havign cropped off his tuft and his bonhomie with non-Brahmins. 

Para 5: I agree with Mr. Manivannan that the Sun TV, Kalaignar TV, etc., are also not doing what they are requiered to do. I understand that they are blackmailed by various brahmin-controlled central government organisation to keep their mouth shut on various social and political issues. I find their roles shameful, too. 

Para 6: I believe that if the descendants want to enjoy the ill-gotten benefits bequeathed to them by their ancestors, they are guilty and must accept the fact that they are subject to criticism. Mr. Manivannan tries to justify the atrocities of Brahmins by citing the atrocities of the intermediate castes against the lower castes. I condemn both while Mr.Manivannan justifies the former by citing the latter. Sadistic. 

Para 7: Will Mr. Manivannan first of all explain why the Brahmins oppose non-Brahmins officiating as priests in the HRCE temples? How dare they filed a statement in the Supreme Court that the God would get polluted if the non-Brahmins go near the deity. The fact is that the clients of Mr. Maninvannan practice apartheid in its cruellest form in India, within the Hindu fold. Apartheid in South Africa was skin-deep. But, the aparthied practised by the Brahmins in India in soul-deep. 

Para 8 & 9:  Mr. Manivannan does not see what he does not want to see. Making priesthood in all the Hindu temples to all the Hindus is the first step towards eradication of caste system. Waxing eloquence pretending not to have seen this point does not make a person a social scientist trying to find answers to the social ills. 

Para 10: As already said apartheid in Hinduism is worse than the apartheid in South Africa. Secondly, as Socrates said cleansing any system is like cleaning the stair case. It must start from the top. It is like removing the top-slab first and then the next and the next. The efforts of Mr.Manivannan to cover up the misdeeds of the Brahmins of the past and present cannot work. 

Para 11 & 12: The Vedic era before the advent of Buddhism was the most barbaric era in the history of the sub-continent when the Chaturvarna system had a field day without anyone opposing it. That era will not be allowed to be resurrected in spite of the efforts of Mr. Manivannan. 

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As long as the Srutis, Smritis which contain anti-subjugated class tirade are eulogised and as long as the Brahmins cling on to them and thereby keep on declaring that I am a Shudra, - with all consequential implications, I am entitled- repeat, I am entitled - to exercise my right of defence and rebel against them with precise and pointed questions. 

When the Brahmins humiliate me, I have to point out only their atrocities. As already mentioned by me in my earlier post, I am for a society that is egalitarian. The requirements, I have enumerated in http://vaeyurutholibangan.blogspot.in/2014/08/towards-civilised-india.html

The sins of the ancestors Vs The role of the descendants - Part II

(Mr. Manivannan has responded with the following counter-arguments, with reference to the write-up "The sins of the ancestors Vs. The role of the descendants". His arguments  in three posts in the Facebook are re-produced here to ensure continuity in the thread, for the benefit of the readers. Numbers have been assigned to paragraphs for easy reference and recall. )

Post 1:

1. The problem with your responses is that it completely washes off personal responsibility for continuing discrimination among "Dravidians" against Dalits and those presumed to be lower than them on the caste hierarchy while it shifts blame to the "Aryans" without any regard for the accomplishments of the greatest Aryans of India - Buddha, Vardhamana Mahavira, Emperor Ashoka among others.

2. Comparison to the Nazi Germany is interesting. But since the Dravidian parties have been ruling at least in Tamil Nadu for almost 50 years with considerable political power, what have the Dravidians accomplished to eradicate caste and religious discrimination? There are no laws against such discrimination in housing, employment, etc. Violence against Dalits are not committed by "Aryans" in Tamil Nadu but by fellow "Dravidians", especially dominant Tamil castes. There is no sense of shame associated with this. The dominant upper castes bristle against varnasrama when they face discrimination but have no hesitation in discriminating against other castes. Isn't that hypocrisy?

3. In all of India, the percentage of people who marry outside their caste is least in Tamil Nadu, the very state that rebelled against Varnasrama. Why is that? While brahmins in Tamil Nadu are increasingly marrying outside their caste including Dalits, Christians and Muslims, dominant non-brahmin castes have been accusing Dalits of Jihad-love and have been rioting. And yet you would conveniently blame even this on brahmins and evade responsibility.

4. Who are the prominent examples among non-brahmin leaders who are equivalents of Lincoln in their treatment of Dalits and other oppressed castes? And when the dominant non-brahmin castes were rioting against Dalits, where were the voices against such rabid casteism?

5. You claim that there is a group that "perpetuates apartheid in society and captures the bureaucracy, media and judiciary through unfair means and terrorist tactics and runs the society with mafia-like grip." Now, with the likes of Sun TV, Kalaignar TV, and others who run powerful media and other business empires and which are all owned by the very people who used to criticize the brahmins, what has been done to counter the "terrorist tactics" that you allege as above? When the Dravidians run the government, own the media, have been graduating overwhelming majority of the engineers, doctors, lawyers and other professionals for nearly fifty years, what has been done to ameliorate discrimination against Dalits or counter the "apartheid" regime that you dicuss?

6. Since you believe that sins of the fathers are inherited by the children, what have the non-Dalit non-brahmin castes have done to compensate for the sin of untouchability and crimes against Dalits that continue even today? Everything that you accuse the brahmins of including the "advantages secured due to historical reasons" that cannot be claimed as fundamental rights are still with the dominant castes of Tamil Nadu, aren't they?

7. In spite of your promise to accept responsibility for the sins of your ancestors, I don't see anything in your writings that reflect that. All that I see are the continued attacks against others for your sins.

8. That will remain the problem if we continue to focus on racist notions in blaming specific groups based on their birth. Had we focused on the idea of universal equality, fundamental human rights, and enforcing them regardless of the perpetrators, we could have become a modern society. Instead, we continue to be an extremely backward society in our thinking, tribal in our social organization, and primitive, racist and bigoted in our outlook. Until we are ready to look at ourselves in the mirror first, accept the crimes that we and our ancestors have done and continue to do, and stop doing that, there is no solution to this. Until we live the life of genuine brotherhood and egalitarianism we have no right to accuse others of not doing that. That is just hypocrisy.

9. So, in your writings, condemn the bigoted behaviors regardless of the accidents of one's birth. But if you continue to believe that only one group of people are responsible for the world's evils, then you are just another hypocrite.

Post 2:

10. …… I am not fine with blaming any groups, Aryan or Dravidian or others. The biggest  problem that I see with most societies is to ascribe their problems to the schemes of others rather than take responsibility themselves, particularly a majority society blaming a tiny minority like the Nazis blaming the Jews. Tamil Nadu is not apartheid era South Africa. Even when there is an oppressive majority as in the case of black Americans fighting for their rights, it required the brilliance of Rev Martin Luther King Jr., to generalize it as civil rights for everyone and bringing along the majority community for a common cause. His "I have a dream" speech is visionary and inspiring. It is tiresome to hear cliched arguments blaming Aryan groups for problems that are entirely solvable. A hierarchical pyramid can be collapsed from below. One doesn't require to start at the top. If you don't accept hierarchy above you, start by rejecting the layers below you. Most of the groups in Tamil Nadu are fighting to climb the hierarchy rather than reject it entirely. That is the real problem.

Post 3:

11. Sir Herbert Risley wrote that the “peculiar” institution of caste would most likely prove to be a challenge for the development of Indian nationality: “So long as a regime of caste persists, it is difficult to see how the sentiment of unity and solidarity can penetrate and inspire all classes of the community”.

12. While India still struggles with deeply rooted prejudices of caste there are some sociologists who believe that caste and varna were far more flexible before the advent of the Europeans and that Manu sastra was irrelevant to most Tamils until the Vijaya Nagara Naickers and then the Europeans took that to be the governing law of Hindus.

What we need is total rejection of any birth based hierarchical rule.

http://www.thehindu.com/.../tp.../article790373.ece

The sins of the ancestors Vs. The role of the descendants!

Mr. Manivannan has, during the course of interaction through Facebook, asked five questions on the sins of ancestors and the responsibility of their descendants. Those questions are attempted to be answered to. They are:

Q 1: Do you believe that some people are born evil because of their birth and/or how they are raised and by whom?

Reply: I do not believe that anybody is born evil. But, when some people join together on the basis of certain identity, and subjugate, in an organised manner, the others who do not have that identity, the evil mentality of that group creates social conflicts in a peaceful society. If that group succeeds in acquiring such dominant position and trains its descendants methodically, to retain its dominant status forever, it is training its descendants to be evils-personified. Such groups are classified as races without conscience.

“...(the Aryan) in his encounters with lower peoples, subjugated them and bent them to his will... As long as he ruthlessly upheld the master attitude, not only did he remain master but also the preserver and increaser of culture”, said Adolf Hitler. -( Pages 86 & 87 - A History of Nazi Germany by William L. Shirer). This was the theory believed and propagated by Hitler. But, the present Germans do not subscribe to this theory. They are ashamed of it. But, they do not suppress the history but transcend beyond it. That is the hallmark of civilisation.

“Germany abounds in history, history to be proud of as well as history to be ashamed of. ….Germans will not let their shame be hidden. They need themselves and the world to know that they have acknowledged the evil that overpowered their nation and will not fall victim again.” - Laura B. Koetter.

I, therefore, believe that nobody is born evil, but when a group does not want to forego the illgotten benefits bequeathed to it by its ancestors and wants to continue with the same terrorist methods adopted by its ancestors, that society is committing organised crime against humanity. They are not only the perpetrators of evil but perpetuators of evil. These people believe in ‘ruthlessly upholding their master attitude’ as advised to them by their ancestor, Hitler.

What Samuel Gompers had said in respect of the conflicts between employers and employees hold good, in India, for the conflicts in social set up.

"When a dominating class wants to keep a subject class under its control, what better way to distract it than to keep it fighting amongst itself. If a subject class is kept busy fighting each other as individuals and trying to gain small advantages or favouritism over each other, it will be all the easier to keep them in check. A subject class which is divided on the basis of arbitrary and superficial differences such as sex, race or nationality will always remain subject” - Samuel Gompers (1850-1924), President of the American Federation of Labour.

Q.2: Do you think that some people can never be clean and will always remain polluted?

Reply: I believe that this question is about the mental make up of the people. As long as a dominant group thinks that it is superior to the others by birth and enforces that theory in public life by preventing the others from occupying the posts appropriated and reserved by it for itself for millennia, that dominant group would have only a polluted mind and would not be rated as clean in its outlook and activities. 

World history testified to the fact that there had been many thinkers in such dominant groups in the West who revolted against such system and worked for the welfare of the subjugated groups. William Wilberforce, Abraham Lincoln, Morris Dees, H.D. Thoreau were a few among them. Their services to the society made the dominant group develop a sense of empathy and that made that dominant group clean.

Q.3: Do you think that some people must be evicted from India because they are descended from people who came from outside India, mainly as invaders but also as traders?

Reply: I am never for any kind of ethnic cleansing anywhere in the world. I  admire Kanian Poongundaranaar. But, I cannot agree to the position that the group which perpetuates apartheid in society and captures the bureaucracy, media and judiciary through unfair means and terrorist tactics and runs the society with mafia-like grip, must be accepted and acquiesced. I am for equality and fraternity as that alone will ensure unity.

I fight against the groups which follow literally, day in and day out, the directives of Hitler, who advised the dominant group to maintain its racial exclusivity. Racial exclusivity has, always, been the choice of only the oppressors. The components of such dominant race must mend themselves and develop empathy.

 “The Aryan gave up the purity of blood and, therefore, lost his sojourn in the paradise which he had made for himself. He became submerged in the racial mixture and gradually lost his cultural creativeness', I have therefore warned, 'The stronger must dominate and not blend with the weaker, thus sacrificing his own greatness. Only the born weakling can view this as cruel”, says Hitler (A History of Nazi Germany - William L. Shirer - Page 87).

Q.4: Do you think that children of tomorrow are guilty of the sins of their ancestors - all of them - from today to 4000 years ago?

Reply: Yes, if those children do not want to be objective in their approach and try to justify the crimes committed by their forefathers against humanity. Why not they learn lessons from the present day Germans who disown Hitler but do not cover-up his misdeeds. The same could be said in respect of the history of Anglophones who harassed the Francophones in Canada two centuries ago. Anglophones of the present day do not justify the crimes committed by their ancestors against the Quebecois. Hon’ble Supreme Court has said, in “State of Punjab Vs. Hira Lal and Others” (C.A. No. 1218 of 1968), “Advantages secured due to historical reasons cannot be claimed as fundamental rights”, dismissing the imaginary grievances of the upper classes. The descendants of the dominant group must realize that they must make the society egalitatian, at least, now. They will not then be guilty of the crimes committed by their forefathers against humanity.   

They should not suppress the past history by usurping the key-posts in the  ICHR or NCERT. I must accept the history as it was. That alone is the first step towards a civilized life.

“It is better to explore and accept history rather than to repress and deny it”, says Edward W. Said in his book Culture and Imperialism. “The two nations must never stop discussing their history’, said President Jiang Zemin while referring to the enmity between China and Japan: ‘only thus can they hope to transcend it.”- The Hindu, December 27, 1998. We must acknowledge the past to transcend the past without getting stuck into the past.

Q.5: Do you accept responsibility for all of the sins of your ancestors?

Reply: Yes. If I continue to enjoy or if I have the intention to continue to retain the ill-gotten benefits bequeathed to me by my ancstors, I must accept responsibility for all the sins of my ancestors. If I am ready to turn a new leaf and make amends, I am not required to assume such responsibility.

Annie Besant, Abraham Lincoln, Bharathiyar and others of their kind are held in high esteem not because they perpetuated the tyranny of their forefathers but because they broke away from the attitude and activities of their dominant group, overturned their tyranny and empathised themselves with the subjugated masses. They need not accept responsibility for the sins of their ancestors.

World returns to peaceful way of life only when the Mightier develops empathy and sense of remorse. Only those who really believe that there is no one superior to them and no one inferior to them can elevate humanity to a civilized status. When, after a struggle of about three decades, the Labour Party came to power with resounding majority in 1945 in England, the President of the Indian National Congress greeted Lord Attlee and said, “Hearty congratulations to the people of Great Britain on the results of the election which demonstrate their abandonment of old ideas and acceptance of a new world”(Page 216- The Transfer of Power in India – V.P. Menon – Orient Longman). Have the people in the dominant group in India, abandoned their old ideas and accepted a new world?

I would be happy, if the dominant group joins hands with me in ushering in that new world. Let history always be the thing of past. It is time we turned new leaf like the Helots and Spartans, learning from history and not repeating the history.

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N.B: In the context of India, the steps to be taken by the society to evolve a civilized India, have been identified and enumerated in the following link, for whatever it is worth:

http://vaeyurutholibangan.blogspot.in/2014/08/towards-civilised-india.html